Suffocating Fish

[fishlady]

Re: Suffocating Fish

does the air quality have anything to do with the o2 content of a tank.....as in the quality of air in the surrounding atmosphere in the house?.....

or maybe it was an entity that has it in for the little guys...you know like a poltergeist????.....

[SteveCGG]

Re: Suffocating Fish

Sorry to hear that....I remember reading something about anaerobic pockets of gas in the substrate....methane, hydrogen sulfide, etc....I'll see if I can find out more info for you

[SteveCGG]

Re: Suffocating Fish

From http://www.mongabay.com/

Ammonia Poisoning
Ammonia poisoning is caused by the buildup of organic waste due to overfeeding, fish or plant deaths and decay, or improper cycling. Ammonia poisoning especially occurs when the pH exceeds 7, when benign ammonium becomes ammonia. Symptoms of ammonia poisoning include sluggish behavior, panting, and gill discoloration (gill burn). Fish may hang just below the water surface. The easiest way to confirm ammonia poisoning is by testing the water. Ammonia poisoning can be reduced by reducing feedings, making water changes, lowering the pH, using zeolites, and increasing aeration.

Nitrite/Nitrate Poisoning
Nitrite/Nitrate poisoning is caused by the same activities as ammonia poisoning. Nitrite/Nitrate poisoning has the same symptoms as ammonia poisoning, and can be tested by a Nitrite/Nitrate water test kit. The best course of action, is to reduce feeding, make frequent partial water changes until the compounds are reduced, and increase the aeration in the water.

Heavy Metal Poisoning
Heavy metal poisoning can result from old pipes and/or metal in the fish tank. Heavy metal poisoning is evident when fish gasp at the surface for air and breath rapidly. Tests are available to measure the amounts of heavy metals in your water. The best way to remove heavy metals is to utilize a reverse osmosis system, although filtering the water through activated carbon and using water conditioners can be substituted.

Hydrogen Sulfide Poisoning
This gas is caused by rotting debris and waste in the gravel of the tank. This gas is toxic and the first signs of its presence is a rotten egg-like odor and fish gasping at the water surface for air. The best measure to take is to make a large water change, using a siphon to remove waste from the gravel. Make partial water changes until the odor is gone and the fish return to normal swimming and breathing.

Other Pollutant poisoning
There are other chemicals (cigarette smoke, paint fumes, pesticides) that sometimes make their way into the fish tank. The best way to combat these pollutants is not to allow them to get in the tank in the first place. However, once a foreign pollutant enters the tank, the results can be drastic for the inhabitants. Try making water changes and filtering with activated carbon to alleviate the problem.

Incorrect Temperature
Most tropical fish are used to living in water with a small temperature variance. When the temperature drops below or exceeds this range, fish can be weakened and left more vulnerable to disease. The best way to prevent wide variances in temperature is to purchase a reliable heater and place the tank away from drafty areas.

Incorrect pH
Most tropical fish live in water with a relatively stable pH. When the pH is not right, the fish are weakened and become more susceptible to illness and infection. Symptoms of an improper pH include darting movements, inflamed and bleeding gills, rapid gill movements, and fish hanging just below the water surface gasping for air. If the pH is way off, do not rapidly restore the pH to normal. Instead, gradually add pH buffers until the proper pH is reached. To help prevent this problem, check the pH on a regular basis.

Oxygen Shortage
A shortage of oxygen can be diagnosed by rapid gill movement and fish hanging just below the water surface. Later, the fish may lose color and die. An oxygen shortage can be caused by several ways: insufficient aeration, a buildup of organic wastes, a high temperature, or through plant respiration. An oxygen deficiency can be solved by a partial water change, an increase in aeration, and removal of dead or dying fish and vegetation.

[eklikewhoa]

Re: Suffocating Fish

FL, yes the surrounding air quality does have an effect on the o2 quality/content in the tank.

If you are not running the A/C during the day then you could possibly be trapping co2 in your home which will then keep the tank from exchanging the co2 in the water for the limited o2 in the air.

[eklikewhoa]

Re: Suffocating Fish

FL, yes the surrounding air quality does have an effect on the o2 quality/content in the tank.

If you are not running the A/C during the day then you could possibly be trapping co2 in your home which will then keep the tank from exchanging the co2 in the water for the limited o2 in the air.

[fishlady]

Re: Suffocating Fish

what a thought .....thanks for that input EK.......
maybe we can change the air quality some in the house..... 8O

[Bogdan]

Re: Suffocating Fish

"If you are not running the A/C during the day then you could possibly be trapping co2 in your home which will then keep the tank from exchanging the co2 in the water for the limited o2 in the air."
eklikewhoa, would you mind to explain above a little bit more, please?

[Zulaab]

Re: Suffocating Fish

The issue EK is talking about is when there is no air movement in a house.  You have to remember in a house with no airmovement the air sits like a blanket over a tank.  My house being of a newer kind runs the air circulation almost all the time, but the AC on and off.. this allows air to move around in the house.
Most people also resolves this issue with having a fan in the house that does the same work.
The problem is that when the temperature rises the "blanket" becomes heavier and more movement is needed to exchange the O2 into the tank.  Remember O2 exchanges are done when the water hits air.. not at any other time.

[eklikewhoa]

Re: Suffocating Fish

Zulaab pretty much explained it.


To add.....

Without circulation in the house co2 builds up from anything the perspires and there is also the co2 coming from anything that is ran off gas in the house since there has to be a pilot light. Most likely if you are not running the air then you are not home so the option of leaving a window open is out of the question too.

You need to somehow exchange the co2 out of the house and the more o2 content in the air inside you home the easier it is for your tank to exchange co2 for o2. Again like zulaab stated the only time gas exchange occurs in your tank is when it is rippled and exposed to the air. Thus the reason why wet/dry filters are superior for aeration and high turnover rates are ideal since it allows for more of the water to be exposed to the small opening of your tank.

A simple test you can do.....

Get some water or even better some saltwater. Test pH inside your home.....then take that same water outside and stir it up and test pH again. Co2 will lower pH and the extra o2 will bring it back up.

[Spot86t]

Re: Suffocating Fish

I know of people who raise daphnia utilizing a small fan blowing across the top of the water to help with the air exchange.  Air from bubblers/stones can get trapped in daphnia shells, eventually killing them.  They tried the fan thing and have been quite happy with the results.  

You could probably pick up some battery operated fans from walmart or a dollar store, then invest in a rechargeable battery setup.  This way even if the power goes out, you've still got some air movement.

[wesleydnunder]

Re: Suffocating Fish

FL, yes the surrounding air quality does have an effect on the o2 quality/content in the tank.

If you are not running the A/C during the day then you could possibly be trapping co2 in your home which will then keep the tank from exchanging the co2 in the water for the limited o2 in the air.

Central AC is a closed system. Even when it's running there is no exchange of air between inside and outside of the house. Even in a closed building with no AC running you should not have lethal pockets of co2 forming arround the tank. I have heard of co2 building up between the water surface and tight-fitting glass covers on tanks.

Mark

[eklikewhoa]

Re: Suffocating Fish

True but circulating air is better then stale air and cool air is better then warm/hot air.

[Mzungu]

Re: Suffocating Fish

The temp in the house was a bit high...maybe 84, we don't run the A/C until the evening hours.

Of everything, I would probably be most concerned with this aspect. Any way to run the A/C even a little bit? It's getting hotter and hotter outside, and without A/C during the day (hottest part) your house could get pretty darn warm.

Do you know what the water temp was in this tank?

Hope everything's still going okay.  :)

[wesleydnunder]

Re: Suffocating Fish

84 may be higher than CF's particular species likes, but it will not cause such severe oxygen depletion to kill his fish. I and many of the discus keepers I know keep their tank temp at 84F constantly. Also, the thermal inertia of the tank water at the time the ac is turned off will slow the heating of the tank water so that it probably won't reach the ambient temp of the room until later in the day. Performing an oxygen uptake with the factors involved can give you a definitive answer to the depletion/temp question. During Hurricane Rita the temperature in my 55 gal reached 95F during the power outtage that lasted for 3 days. I lost all tyhe fish in my other tanks but didn't lose a single fish in the heavily-stocked 55 due to the arduous work of a school of zebra danios whose frantic movements at the tank's surface kept the water oxygenated enough for the inhabitants to survive.

Mark

[wesleydnunder]

Re: Suffocating Fish

True but circulating air is better then stale air and cool air is better then warm/hot air.

I agree. However, your original post concerning trapping C02 in the house because the AC was turned off has no basis in fact.

Mark