curing ick without chemicals.

[tsunderl]

Ick will attack scaleless fish first and so loaches are usually the first to show signs of it. I've used Kick Ick with great success. It is safe for ALL fish and I don't do anything to my filters. It's an every other day regimin and very easy to use. I recently rescued a couple of black skirts that had ick BAD and this stuff has cleared them up in a week. I'm also using Quick Cure since they were so bad just to ward off secondary infections. I am surprised they made it. Another week and they will be in the big tank!

[stevenallenbarnard]

I don't know, I'm definatly a fan of the heat/salt method now. I only wish I would have started sooner, but if you believe it this is the first time in over 15 years of aquarium keeping that I've ever encountered the ich. seriously though, i was more worried about my ghost knife, seeing as he was the most expensive. but he's yet to develope any signs. just happy to be seeing a light at the end of the tunnel.

[imagirlgeek]

I just treated 5 little puffers with Ich Attack, and the ich was completely gone after 3 days. I treated using the full dosage. I tried for 3 days using the salt and heat method, but finally broke down and bought the meds. I figured if it didn't work out, I could just do a massive water change and go back to salt and heat. All 5 puffers are completely ich free and doing well.

[patrick hoang]

keep higher temp on all scaless fish is a must, but make sure have plenty of oxygen. The best temp is 84-86 for scaless, 82-84 for with scale.

[Reefahholic]

Guys, I'm sorry but just about everything I've read hear is not accurate. My apologies as I would like to clear the myths and misinformation.

Increasing Temp will not kill ICH unless it's unsafe for fish and coral. Then there's no documentation for exactly how high the temp needs to be or for how long.
Heat/Salt method is a myth.
Hyposalinity can be effective, but there's been strains that are
resistant.
ICH attack is a mere bandaid.

ICH can remain undetected in the gills for months
Fish can develope an immunity when they're in stable conditions and in good health.

Don't be fooled into believing nonsense.

Tank Transfer Method is by far the best way to stop the life cycle. Easiest on the fish.
Fish in QT on 1st
4th transfer
7th transfer
10th transfer
13th transfer and done

**ALL equipment (and I mean everything) needs to be sterilized inbetween transfers** tank, heaters, powerheads, everything.
Mild bleach solution, rinse well, let dry


The next best way is Copper at a therapeutic level. 0.2-0.3 ppm for 2-4 weeks. Must be tested and maintained at this level for minimal of 14 days. Longer the better.


Fallow period for a DT is 72-76 days. 76 days as worst case scenario.


For more info about ICH and the other most common marine diseases....you can download my guide at marsh-reef.org

Free to everybody. Everything is in there. Search my name on marsh. It will be in a recent thread. I would've attached it here, but can't.

[Reefahholic]

Kindest regards....and best of luck with your fishes!

[imagirlgeek]

Thank you for the information. I wanted to clarify something though. You seem to be focusing on marine ich in your post, while all the other posts were specific to Freshwater Ich, since this is primarily a Freshwater forum.

Also, the increased temp is used to speed up the lifecycle, so that other methods of killing or removing the parasite can be implemented on a shorter timeline.

I have successfully cured a total of 25 South American puffers using salt, heat, tank transfer (QT tanks), and Ich Attack. I would agree that the tank transfer was likely the most effective part of this process, but I didn't bleach anything between transfers. I'm not arguing against your bleach/dry method, but you could also just let the equipment dry out without bleach since the Ich protozoan cannot live outside water, and when dried the cell wall collapses destroying the parasite. This is true for both the freshwater and saltwater species.

Again, thank you for adding to the discussion, but I would hope that the experiences of others would not be dismissed as myth when dealing with different species of a parasite in different aquarium settings.

Guys, I'm sorry but just about everything I've read hear is not accurate. My apologies as I would like to clear the myths and misinformation.

Increasing Temp will not kill ICH unless it's unsafe for fish and coral. Then there's no documentation for exactly how high the temp needs to be or for how long.
Heat/Salt method is a myth.
Hyposalinity can be effective, but there's been strains that are
resistant.
ICH attack is a mere bandaid.

ICH can remain undetected in the gills for months
Fish can develope an immunity when they're in stable conditions and in good health.

Don't be fooled into believing nonsense.

Tank Transfer Method is by far the best way to stop the life cycle. Easiest on the fish.
Fish in QT on 1st
4th transfer
7th transfer
10th transfer
13th transfer and done

**ALL equipment (and I mean everything) needs to be sterilized inbetween transfers** tank, heaters, powerheads, everything.
Mild bleach solution, rinse well, let dry


The next best way is Copper at a therapeutic level. 0.2-0.3 ppm for 2-4 weeks. Must be tested and maintained at this level for minimal of 14 days. Longer the better.


Fallow period for a DT is 72-76 days. 76 days as worst case scenario.


For more info about ICH and the other most common marine diseases....you can download my guide at marsh-reef.org

Free to everybody. Everything is in there. Search my name on marsh. It will be in a recent thread. I would've attached it here, but can't.

[Reefahholic]

Thank you for the information. I wanted to clarify something though. You seem to be focusing on marine ich in your post, while all the other posts were specific to Freshwater Ich, since this is primarily a Freshwater forum.

Also, the increased temp is used to speed up the lifecycle, so that other methods of killing or removing the parasite can be implemented on a shorter timeline.

I have successfully cured a total of 25 South American puffers using salt, heat, tank transfer (QT tanks), and Ich Attack. I would agree that the tank transfer was likely the most effective part of this process, but I didn't bleach anything between transfers. I'm not arguing against your bleach/dry method, but you could also just let the equipment dry out without bleach since the Ich protozoan cannot live outside water, and when dried the cell wall collapses destroying the parasite. This is true for both the freshwater and saltwater species.

Again, thank you for adding to the discussion, but I would hope that the experiences of others would not be dismissed as myth when dealing with different species of a parasite in different aquarium settings.

Yes, I was referring to saltwater ICH. Yes, you can let the equipment dry inbetween transfers, but it's been reported the water inside suction cups for jäger heaters, pumps, small amount of water left inside a tank has reinfected fish. Yep, that's why mild bleach solution is recommended. Then there's no possible way other than aerosol transmission. Or did you know about that? BTW...ICH attack "does not" cure ICH in fresh or saltwater. That's a proven fact. Turning the temp up will speed up the life cycle. Why turn temp up and add salt when the TTM has been proven to work without doing either of those. Just sayin'....if you'd rather waste salt...that's up to you.

[imagirlgeek]

Of course, if someone thinks they are completely drying their equipment, but in reality are leaving water behind, no surprise that they could be reinfected. I'm just saying that introducing bleach into your system is risky if you aren't careful about fully rinsing and fully drying the equipment, especially if the items are porous.

As for why use salt...in freshwater systems, salt acts as a general therapeutic agent by promoting mucus production and also the healing of damaged skin and gill tissue. Salt also has a beneficial osmoregularity and anesthetic effect on stressed fish.

I'm not knocking your process. TTM is obviously a very good method, but it's not the only method. Especially for those new to the hobby who may not have multiple tanks to work with. That's why I like to have multiple options for multiple scenarios experienced by multiple hobbyists.

Yes, I was referring to saltwater ICH. Yes, you can let the equipment dry inbetween transfers, but it's been reported the water inside suction cups for jäger heaters, pumps, small amount of water left inside a tank has reinfected fish. Yep, that's why mild bleach solution is recommended. Then there's no possible way other than aerosol transmission. Or did you know about that? BTW...ICH attack "does not" cure ICH in fresh or saltwater. That's a proven fact. Turning the temp up will speed up the life cycle. Why turn temp up and add salt when the TTM has been proven to work without doing either of those. Just sayin'....if you'd rather waste salt...that's up to you.

[Reefahholic]

Roger that. If you have multiple tanks.

Copper is your best friend because you can test it.

0.2-0.3ppm for salt is therapeutic level. It's less for freshwater.

Cupramine is very good. Freshwater is 0.5 mg/L. Or 8 drops per 10.5/G.

Looking for a accurate test kit that's better than what most use?

Google CHEMMetrics copper test. Very precise test.

Keep at therapeutic level for 14 days.