new plants dying

[SmplyB77]

Ok, I have a 30gal. tank that I've set up about two weeks ago. About one week ago I planted a med. Amazon sword, a couple of bronze do-hickies, some tall grass, and spiral grass( can't remember the names). All are suppose to be low maintenance and med to low light. As of Monday 3/1/10 they were all begining to look a little ruff and thin Wensday evening I added a few fish, and now (thursday morning) the plants are turning brown and falling apart. I have two 30w bulbs both new, one grow, one regular, Sand bottom, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate levels are normal, I've been adding the correct amount of flourish excel CO2 every couple of days. Wensday I added the flourish tabs to the sand throughout the tank and continued with the liquid flourish.
If it's not to late will the plants come back? How long should I give them? Or should I just pull them and start over with new ones?

[Mzungu]

Can you post pictures? That could be the result of several different things.

Are ALL the plants deteriorating in the same way and the same amount?

Where did you get the plants?

What do you mean by "normal?" Can you post values for the tests you ran?

And, lastly, welcome to HFB!

[SmplyB77]

I can get some pics this evening. the bronze things are holding up the best. The amazon sword has lost about half of the leaves, and the grasses are extremely deteroratiing. All are going about the same way. The blades/leaves begin to go transparent, then turn brown and fall apart. I'd rather keep the businesses name out of the situation as they've been a big help in setting up this tank.
pH-7.6, High Range pH-7.8, Ammonia-.25ppm, Nitrite-0ppm, and Nitrate-0ppm

[Roujin]

What's the water temp?

[SmplyB77]

80

[Somefishguy]

If you got any crypts then it is very common for the leves to die off and grow back when transplanted.

Can you give more info on the bulbs you have. What rating are they?

[imagirlgeek]

Someone more experienced than me can confirm or deny this, but it sounds like an Iron deficiency. Plant leaves thinning then dying and falling off....isn't that due to a lack of iron?

[SmplyB77]

I'll check on the actual names this afternoon

[nhung]

You plants seem to be lacking fertilizer. Even though the plants you bought may be low maintenance, sand and water alone does not have enough nutrient to keep them alive. Most low maintenance plants get their nutrient from the decomposing fish food and waste, but since did not add fish until Wednesday, your plants did not receive the nutrient they need for two week. Flourish Excel and Flourish liquid does not have the basic nitrogen, potassium, and phosphorus plants need. The tablet you put in the sand should help. I would give the plants 3 to 4 days to recover.

The tall grass and spiral grass are probably val and corkscrew val.

[SmplyB77]

ok, So I got the names and the pics for the plants: Amazon sword, crypt bronze, vallisneria, and vallisneria spiralis. I also talked to my fish guys and we came up with this. I have enough wattage, two 30watt bulbs, but with black sand it takes away from the light basically cutting it in half. the sand isn't deep enough, has no nuetrients except for what I recently added, and the plants are probably in shock. Results. I should clean out the dead leaves/blades, increase the depth of the sand using a lighter color, continue with the flourish excel + tabs, and give it a couple of weeks and see what happens... any other thoughts?

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[Mzungu]

I agree with all but the substrate part.

BTW, thanks for posting pics! Those REALLY help.

It seems as though your Vals are having the most trouble. I've heard from other members on here that Vals do NOT react well to Flourish Excel. No idea why, but many people have said that. So that's a very good possibility as to why your Vals aren't doing so well.

Actually, now that I look again, it's pretty much ONLY your Vals that are having trouble. Everything else looks pretty good.

How deep would you say your sand bed is?

With 2 30W bulbs, that would be considered a low-light tank, since you essentially have 2 wpg. The crypts and the sword should do okay with this - the sword will probably grow a bit slowly, but it shouldn't do badly otherwise. And with everything else except the Excel, the Vals should do well also.

Definitely clean up the dead leaves - those are just going to rot in your tank and the rot may extend to the healthy part of the plant.

[wesleydnunder]

Excel can cause vals to melt. Often, they will come back strong. When I gave Naps some vals several years ago, I warned him about the excel and he experienced the melting problem. Later, he reported that they'd come back. Six months later his tank looked like a jungle. Sand is poor for transporting nutrients to roots but root tabs usually take care of that for root feeders like swords and crypts. The tank is new so the sand is pretty sterile. After it gets a little organic material in it (matures some) the vals will be better able to send out runners and multiply.

Looking at the pics, your vals look pretty far gone. If they die away completely, don't be afraid to try them again after the tank matures some. If it's any consolation, corkscrew vals can be tough to grow in the best of situations.

Mark

[SmplyB77]

Mzungu what don't you agree with about the substrate?

Thanks to all... I'm cleaning the dead leaves out this weekend and doing a partial water change, not sure if the waters turning brown because of the wood(boiled and soaked) I added or the dead plants. I'll let ya'll know how things turn out.

[cameracorpus]

I've found that wood (varies by species, of course) can leach for a very long time. My 55 still had tannin colored water after a year and it didn't really have THAT much wood in it.

I agree with the Excel doing the damage. Mainly because I did exactly the same thing with my planted tank except for the Excel same WPG, non-nutritious substrate, everyting. I put in root tabs at about 2x the package instructions after a month. Everything made it, no melting. Oh, and after 3 months this one still has brown water.

I bet your stuff will grow back. It just seems like it takes forever when you are watching it.

[BeefyG]

I have some small bottles of iron and potassium and maybe some other stuff I can give him if you all think that would help. I'll have to check the box when I get home to see what I actually have.

B,
I'll bring that extra light and the pool filter sand on Monday so you can try it out if you want. If yours doesn't come back I may have some extra spiral val and regular val too.