This marks the end

[Darbex]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090324/ap_on_bi_ge/bailout_bernanke_geithner

This marks the beginning of the what the liberals have been planning the socialist control of our free markets. :furious:

[stevenallenbarnard]

Yeah, cause why should we be able to tell large banks and companies who recieve billions of dollars in bail out money how they have to use it. What happened to the good ol' days of the Bush administration when the government only took away individuals right (patriot act) and left big business to do as it pleases. Cause we all know that big business only wants what's best for the country, and that there is noooo way they would make greedy and unscrupulous practices solely for the purpose of lining their own pocket books. The end indeed.

[cichlid1409]

Yeah, cause why should we be able to tell large banks and companies who recieve billions of dollars in bail out money how they have to use it. What happened to the good ol' days of the Bush administration when the government only took away individuals right (patriot act) and left big business to do as it pleases. Cause we all know that big business only wants what's best for the country, and that there is noooo way they would make greedy and unscrupulous practices solely for the purpose of lining their own pocket books. The end indeed.

Oh and theres noooo way that government would like to control business for any other reason than to expand their power and control. today its banks tomorrow its your private business.

[stevenallenbarnard]

Oh and theres noooo way that government would like to control business for any other reason than to expand their power and control. today its banks tomorrow its your private business.

But, if my PUBLICLY traded company is going under, mostly in part to bad business practices I have made, and the government offers me 2 options, go out of business or let us step in and restructure, then I'm going to do what's necessary to make sure I continue to recieve a paycheck.

[stevenallenbarnard]

Besides, they could just turn down the money and go out of business.

[Darbex]

Not going to touch that comment Steve so we dont get into a political discussion. However, if any party were to do the above I would be furious. They would have liked to have this in place so they could have controlled AIG before the bailout in theory to divert them from disaster. If anyone looks into what caused this problem it is Congress and Clinton/Bush's to allow the financial markets to push the social agenda of allowing people to go so far on credit that they couldnt pay off. Banks were more than happy to accomadate the request since they were given a risk free chance to charge crazy interest rates with the idea that if any went bad the government would take them with the powers of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The only problem was that FAS 157 an accounting standard made all banks have to revalue all assets at current market prices. Well all those loans that were made to push the agenda were worth pennies on the dollars due to the collectability. And if social control is so good for business tell me why Europe is hurting right now from the same problems that we are facing yet most of Europe is a socialist system. The Europeans have systems similar to what Tax Cheat Geithner is purposing and they couldnt stop it. The funny thing is their laws and accounting regulations didnt even impose what the FASB did and yet their banks began failing left and right, why? Well because as soon as everyone saw the investments the US financial was invested in they began questioning what are our banks doing and to their suprise they found out the were just as bad and in the case of some like the Icelandic banks were worse. The lovely part of the unfethered bailout of all financial companies the US has bailed foreign banks billions of our tax dollars.

[stevenallenbarnard]

I'm just saying, we've seen what writing blank checks to these large institutions can lead to. And you're right when you talk about how much of this money has gone to pay off foreign investors. This should have been oversighted when the first TARP bills were rolled out. Same w/ the AIG bonus fiasco. But what happens when all these companies/banks begin going under one by one. When no one has a job, the we will all be looking to the government and asking why they didn't fix this. No one seems to have a fool proof answer. This whole country seems more interested in deciding who to blame than about actually fixing the situation.

[Darbex]

The fix is to allow them to go into bankruptcy. Will it hurt yes but the alternative will cause us more pain in the long run. This administration can not continue their fiscal policies and not realize the destruction on our economy tomorrow. Geithner and Obama just recently announced that they will spend roughly 1 trillion to buy back Treasury bills from the banks to stimulate the economy. This will have the desired impact in the short term. The problem lies in the banks will sell the bills to the Treasury and sit on the money because there is no incentive in this climate to loan it out. When the economy picks up the banks will begin loaning it out at low rates since there will be so much money out there. Then since the public will now have all of this money to spend then prices will begin to rise you will soon see inflation hitting double digits for the first time since the Carter/Reagan years. The only way to correct this is a recession again. This administration is about to send our economy on a roller coaster for the next 6-10 years for no reason. If someone with balls would say no and allow the bad apples to go bankrupt it is the only way we will learn. Its just like an individual if you keep helping someone that cant help themselves then you will allow them to continue to need assistance but if you allow them to fall hard once then more than likely they will learn from their mistake to not repeat the pain they went through.

[Darbex]

The sad thing is China yes China has strongly requested that the Obama admin not continue with the plan mentioned above and other fiscal policies since they have hundreds of billions invested in the US. Since when has a foreign nation ever told us what to do? This is just so funny that I want to laugh what we have allowed to happen its almost unbelievable. I knew that their would be a spending spree but I even under estimated the levels.

[stevenallenbarnard]

IMO buying up these bills and bad mortgages is what the government should have done to begin with. If you're going to spend tax payer dollars the tax payer should have a vested interest. But I think letting a mega financial institution fail and letting an individual fail are two different arguments. Essentially, would we rather spend the money to help fix these companies, or would we rather spend it on the unemployment benefits, food stamp benefits, and medicaid benefits. Not to mention the fact that it all but guaranteed that as the job market dries up that the crime rate will increase as people become more and more desperate to feed their families. So we're going to have to pay to incarcerate those people as well. We just have to decide how the money would be better spent

[cichlid1409]

what the govt should have done in the first place is not have forced the mortgage companies to hand out loans to people who couldn't afford them. This has caused a overspending balloon of debt which has now burst not only messing with peoples credit and housing situations but causing the banks to lose tons of money putting them in the place they are now. if the govt would have stayed out of it then we would be fine now. recessions like this may cause the rise and fall of businesses but that is the how capitalism works if GM cant sell enough cars to pay the bills its time to close the doors, someone else will be along soon to pick up their slack. we are doing nothing for the state of the country by spending trillions of dollars except inflating our market values decreasing the dollar and borrowing from commies like china(bad idea).

[Darbex]

Took the words out of my mouth

[cichlid1409]

great minds think alike

[marauder_77868]

In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. From time to time we've been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. Well, if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price.
--Ronald Reagan

GOVERNMENT DOES NOT CREATE WEALTH

If you want to grow the economy, and thus end our current recession, get the government out of the equation.

[Darbex]

And now he tries to explain on tv his socialist power grab. And explains their will be over whelming support from the public and we should trust the government. Pshh they are the ones who helped stoke the fire.