Newbie to S/W, Don't want a reef. Just a nice display. Advice, Input?

[CptCrusty1]

I've been reading the stickies up at the top of this forum and it seems they are oriented towards Reef Tanks. I've had f/w cichlid and community tanks in the past and have done well with them.

I"m about to buy a 60g tank from a LFS and the guy is telling me that if I do a basic non-Reef tank, it's similar in effort to a well established F/W tank. Before I start construction and cycling of the tank, I want to make sure I have all the equipment I need.

From my F/W days, I have an external canister filter (can't remember brand) rated at 85gph. I also have a Schego SW3 Bubbler. My understanding is that I'll need to buy "live sand" @ 1lb/gal, so 3 bags. Is there anything to be said for more sand?

My wife and kids want ornaments in the tank such as a ship, or (god forbid) sponge bob's pineapple house. And of course, they will want Dory and Nemo/Marlin.

I'm looking for a basic setup, not looking to get into a reef. I know I have some purchases to make regarding needs for additional water flow/circulation in the tank. I know I'll need to purchase a hydrometer and additional test kits above what I already have.

Please be kind and help a noob to salt water do it right the first time.

Thanks
Crusty.

EDIT... Salt... can't forget the salt.... LOL

[trbkrb]

True, a basic SW tank is not more trouble than a FW tank, in my experience. I actually spend less time on mine per month than I did on our 55gal FW tank. Most of the SW tanks, if you don't want corals, are FOWLR tanks using live rock as the biological filters. You don't "need" all live sand or rock, and in most cases sand is more decorative than a firm requirement that you have X lbs per gallon. I have about 2" of sand in my 65 gal tank, and it is mostly for that natural look, along with about 75-80 lbs of rock.

Rock is especially good as it will provide a natural hiding place for your fish. You don't necessarily need all live rock, you can start out with dry rock and dry sand and create your own ammonia cycle to populate the biological filters, but it will take longer. Live rock and some live sand from others in the hobby can be added to provide more bio diversity to your tank as they will contain small invertibrates, sponges, purple coraline algae, maybe even some snails or small starfish.

Are you a member on MARSHreef ? I know there are several members out your way in the SW area that could certainly give you some help, let you see their setups, help with sand and rock, etc. and there is always stuff for sale on there. We are always ready to help out newbies to the hobby. And don't count out corals totally. You can grow some of the basic ones pretty easily, and they really add to the natural appearance of your tank. That is what my wife prefers on our SW tank over the FW ones we've had in the past. So much more interesting to look at.

Old pic of mine:

http://i635.photobucket.com/albums/uu77/trbstang/sw1.jpg

Good luck!

[CptCrusty1]

Ok.. so you've been kind enough with your response and not blasted me... I greatly appreciate that.

So... additional questions. Will I have sufficient filtration with the External filter? Rated at 85g for a 60? Do I need more filtration? I'd be happy to hang one on the back.

[johnnymisty]

I dont like the canister filters on salt tanks just my opinion i think getting an ac110 would be a better option since you can turn it into a refugium incase you decide to add corals I myself have never done fowlr only reef tanks and use refugiums on my tanks but i have seen plenty of fish only with just bio wheel hang on back filters and keep fish just fine

[CptCrusty1]

Fowlr? Ac110?

[johnnymisty]

Fish only with live rock and aqua clear 110

[CptCrusty1]

Ok.. . So now I'm educated with regards to the AC110... I've always thought those systems were inferior to Canisters as the canister is physically large, at least in my case... looking at the AC110, my 85 has much more capacity for media.... and snails... lol.. another story.

4 trays, 1 for charcoal, 1 for coarse mesh material, 1 for fine mesh, 1 for additional strata, or something you want to put in there. Each tray is 8 inches square... am I missing something? I have 2 Fluval 60's like the AC110 but it has 2 areas for filter media. These are on the back of a 55, so effectivley 120g worth of filtration. It takes the Cartridges with filter media surrounding charcoal x2 per. so 4 total. between those 2, I still have way more media in my canister than in those 2 doubled hanging filters.

Again, I don't know everything so feel free to educate me. (In Dr. Evil voice) I am the diet coke of fish hobbiests.

[aesl1982]

Newbie to S/W, Don't want a reef. Just a nice display. Advice, Input?

Canister filters can become nitrate factories. Your rock and sand is what filters your water as biological filtration. Are you going to run a sump?

[mistahoo]

Re: Newbie to S/W, Don't want a reef. Just a nice display. Advice, Input?

AC110 > fluval 60

Those filter cartridges are trash, hence why the aquaclear filters don't use them. Also, charcoal is worthless in the aquarium unless you're trying to remove medication whereas a simple water change can handle that.

Sent from my spaceship using Tapatalk 2.

[rage]

Whether it's a canister or hang-on-back power filter , to do its job as a mechanical filter, it has to trap detritus. If it traps detritus then it can become nitrate factory. If it doesn't trap detritus then it does not do its job.
To keep the detritus to turn into nitrate, just clean it often.

These filter can also server as biological filter, depending on the surface area of the media, some are good, some are not so good.
In salt water, a better biological filter is live rocks. They also serve as landscape and hiding place for the fish.

I don't see the point of using a AC110 or Fluval unless you already have one sitting in the garage. An AC110 is a poor man sump/ refugium. Use it only if you already have one and want to save money.

[Bakapuma]

Even in a fowlr tank I used a skimmer in a sump. The nitrate problem, even though it can be higher in a fowlr, will still produce an undesirable amount of algae. Yes you can use clean up critters but they, unlike the fish, will have difficulty with the high nitrate concentration in the water. (Also some of the tank mates may eat them too) I think if you set this up right you wont have to spend anymore time on it than with a FW setup. I know that I my FW planted tanks required much more attention than the fowlrs I have had in the past. If I were to set up a fowlr today I would use an in skimmer protien skimmer. Look into it. I think in the long run it will save time, money, and headaches. my 2c

[Bpb]

+1 on running a skimmer. Your canister filter may have more volume, but that will be more space to trap junk and they're a pain to keep clean. Marine micro algae seems to grow far faster and more aggressively than freshwater algae do so keeping everything clean will really help you. One thing nobody mentions, but that really shocked me when I set up my reef tank is the amount of detritus that accumulates. I've had freshwater and planted tanks for years and my reef tank manages to accumulate more detritus in a week than my planted tanks do in a month. And I feed the reef less. There's just so much more life in a saltwater tank with real live rock. More life and higher light mean more detritus and more algae.

The ac110 will have comparable (if not more) flow, and be infinitely easier to clean. You can have your plastic decor if the family demands it but live rock will truly be the meat and potatoes of your biological filtration.

even if you don't want corals, you still don't want a tank with soaring nitrates that is covered in cyano and hair algae. Just my $0.02.